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Temper, temper

  1. startlingmoniker

    I read a lot of the forum entries, mostly because I'm curious what problems folks are running into-- I figure maybe it will help me sometime in the future. Anyhow, I notice that "drmike" and "timethief" tend to be a bit quick with users.

    I know you're volunteering your time or whatever-- and I thank you for it-- but I just thought I'd give you a heads up that you both are too quick jumping on people sometimes, and it comes off as a little rude.

    That's all, back to blogging.

  2. In drmike's defense, he's a moderator and does alot here without getting paid.

  3. defrostindoors

    I worked tech support for years (still do it part-time) and I have to say, you DO get really really tired of answering the same questions over and over, when the information people seek is easily accessible in the FAQs or wherever, or they want you to do a lot of hand-holding. I'm not saying users are like that, but...yeah, you get a little tired when you get the 923rd "omg I can't do this and what do you mean the instructions are online?!" message. Even if they do read the FAQs, they figure their particular instance is just that much different so they need specific instructions (99.98% of the time they don't). At my job I always hoped that people would actually start to learn more so they'd need less help, but actually as things became easier and more ubiquitous, the average user's knowledge base got smaller. When I got online for the first time in the early 90s it required at least a modicum of tech knowledge to get on t'interweb; it's like how you had to be your own mechanic when cars first appeared. The 734th instance of "rawr my images aren't appearing YOU SUCK" can wear a person down, which brings me to my next point. I know drmike and others also get tired of people coming on and being abusive towards the staff here because they, the users, can't figure out how to do something. That's not's fault; that's pure operator error. RTFM! Being a jerk about it will not make you an internet hero. People need to take a wee bit of responsibility IMHO.

  4. startlingmoniker

    Hey, I completely understand what you're saying. I'm just advocating that they might take a step back, and maybe take a deep breath or two. As I understand, they're volunteering, so letting a few FAQ-phobes cool their heels isn't going to get them fired or anything.

  5. defrostindoors

    I do know what you mean. :) If they let it sit, though, they run the risk of people posting multiple times, getting angrier and angrier. I don't know what the solution for that might be.

  6. @startlingmoniker
    As you have enough time on your hands and enough sass to sit on your fat ass, critically observing the voluntary efforts of others and judging them - I'm here to strongly encourage you to either belly up to the bar and demonstrate your expertise at answering forum questions or to put a sock in it.

  7. Just a quick mention, thank you for bring up the issue startlingmoniker. I was wondering how to post my feeling about the issue and what's going through my mind right now.

    Considering that I got rather tasteless email from a staff member yesterday who I feel has dropped the ball when it comes to client services around here and is totally and seriously ignorant with what is occuring here in the forums, considering that 75% of the time we don't get even a thank you from folks asking for our help, see little to no assistance or support from staff members, see little to no follow up from requests to staff members about broken issues pretaining to the forums that prohibit us from providing assistance to those clients of theirs, considering that is a Commerical operation that is relying on the support and time of unpaid volenteers to provide first line support 7 days a week no less than 14 hours a day and triage on the weekends so that staff can get time off, considering that I'm averaging oeer a hundred emails a week from folks here asking for help, considering that staff is unwilling to step in with upset clients of theirs here in the forums and is relying on us to calm those clients down, considering that we're now down to a total of 4 volenteers here for the most part helping out when 3 months ago it was more, considering that staff has removed features here in the forums (like changing thethread close feature to basically make it into a delete key, no longer defaulting the username to link to the default account) that have activitally made it harder to help out around here, considering that staff is hiring folks who state that "I can't code..." seems to be a job requirment. considering that ...

    Yup, I'm mad about that email. I should have saved it but silly me trashed it.

    Gotta admit that while I disagree with TT's choice of language, I agree with the ideas behind them. Put up or shutup, startlingmoniker.

    abusive towards the staff

    Abusive to staff? How about abusive to us? How about staff now being abusive to us? You should see what I delete around here.

    The point was raised by that staff member that sent me that email that I seem to suggest to folks that I am a paid employee around here. I would like someone to point to just once where I came off stating that I was as such. Do that and I'll point out the hundreds of times where I've stated that I and the others here are not and do this as a volenteer. Also considering that many posts around here start off with "Dr. Mike...", I feel a lot of the folks that Automattic has here as clients think that I am. That ain't my fault.

    Well, I've had my say.

    (edit: I'm half tempted to make this a current issue sticky on the front page. You'll note that I'm taking the day off.)

  8. OK, I answered one question....

    edit: Please excuse my typoes up there. I don't feel like fixing them.

    There is one issue that I would like to point out. Take a look at the low number of unanswered threads we have here. Please compare that agaianst the number of answered threads (Note that that's only for the support subforum) and also take a gander over at and see how much doesn't get answered over there.

    I think we go beyond the call of duty around here.

  9. By the way, startlingmoniker, your sidebar is dropping to the bottom in IE. It's those archie comics and the image in the post right above it. They're too wide and are focing the sidebar down.

    (OK, three questions now including the quickie over at

    edit: Anyone want to bet that this thread disappears without comment?

  10. How about the international forums?

  11. i see where startlingmoniker is coming from, but after drmike's explanation i now understand his situation better, along with the other regular volunteers who come off as snappish.

    drmike, i do try to say thanks after every support help i get from you whether here or your wpmu platform, and if i forget sometimes please excuse me. i'm sure i say for many people who read the forums that we appreciate what you do with how much time and means you have.


  12. Singling people out in the forum and pointing out what you don't like about them is not a productive way of bringing about the changes you're looking for. Obviously.

    Also, ya get what ya pay for. I like Dr Mike's suggestion about stepping up and answering questions yourself; you're more than capable of doing a forum search and finding answers for people, so why not do that. I spent six hours last night responding to "my widgets are gone! Mine too! Mine too!" and a little help from other forum members was much appreciated. And hey, if you start answering questions it would probably decrease the number of forum posts by other people, thus forestalling the chance of rudeness.

  13. The forum quote of the year ...

    ... if you start answering questions it would probably decrease the number of forum posts by other people, thus forestalling the chance of rudeness.


  14. Thanks. As with everything, time will tell.

  15. startlingmoniker

    Oh I don't know.. I thought yours was pretty good for making my point, Time-- right out of the box with "fat ass!"

    I made it perfectly clear in my opening post that I understand you're volunteers, and I DID thank you for your helpful service. I didn't call anyone a fat ass, that's for sure. I also didn't criticize your ability to answer questions aptly, just your often serious lack of etiquette when doing so. I think that's a pretty big difference!

    Think about it this way-- if WordPress's front line of people is basically the both of you, and we can safely assume that the majority of users won't know you aren't paid staff-- then any rudeness on your part is rubbing off on WordPress itself, right?

    Ack. Anyhow, this was all just a friendly notice was someone that not only notices and appreciates what you do, but gives a damn about the community as a whole. History shows time and time again that you can ignore these things, but usually at a cost.

  16. startlingmoniker

    And oh-- thanks for the IE display tip. I'll let 'em fend for themselves, though. It's 2007; they should be stepping out of the stone age and using Firefox! ; )

  17. Thanks for the condescension: I, along with much of the world, can't afford a computer that will run Firefox. When can I expect that cheque, Mr. Jetson?

  18. I'd just like to say to all the volunteers here and the staff, I freaking Love wordpress and not just for its pretty templates, those those are pretty special too.

    I had a template problem the other day, couldn't find an answer to the problem shot off a request to support and voila two days max before i noticed everything was back to normal. Seeing as my problem was really really small, I appreciate it folks. Also I have never been let down by anything wordpress.

    Just saying.

  19. Thanks for the feedback. Please note that I don't have anything against helping folks. It's just gotten out of hand and I feel like Automattic is professionally relying on it to help run their bussiness. Every other Corporate website I know and am a member of, there's a lot more input from actual employees of the company.

    I'm also taken exception with one employee's conduct and am planing on making an offical complaint shortly. I doubt it will do any good though.

  20. Also do note that I started answering questions here because I saw a need that wasn't being filled. Many support questions were being asked and not responded to. I saw a need and did my best to provide help. I didn't ask to be a moderator. That was dropped into my lap without even a "Would you like to be the moderator?..."

  21. startlingmoniker

    Sounds like you ought to hand it back to them, Doc! I'd be damned if someone press-ganged me into service, especially with the treatment you mention. Hmm... the problem runs deep!

  22. Yup, the thought's been going through my head.

  23. @drmike:
    ditch 'em

  24. Folks here don;t understand how good they have it here either. I made a post on the sixapart forums 24 hours ago and it still han't been answered.

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